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Monday, April 13, 2009

I Get E-Mails

I have just received this intriguing e-pistle:
Hi Dale. Have you heard about the idea that you conspired with transhumanists to set yourself up as a leading antagonist, to promote external attention and internal self-critical analysis as a consequence of increased controversy?

Does anybody know of any texts online or otherwise in which this thesis is seriously proposed that are actually available for examination?

Of what is this conspiracy supposed to have consisted, I wonder, and how on earth is it supposed to have been of benefit to me or anybody else for that matter to critique superlative futurology in a small-readership blog? Surely it seems a bit implausible on its face? Something about this seems weird and not right to me. What am I missing here?

15 comments:

jimf said...

> Something about this seems weird and not right to me.
> What am I missing here?

You need to 'fess up to the part about how you're in contact
with benevolent superintelligences from the future in a
time-line that's trying mightily to amalgamate with our own,
and who send you messages via a Ouija board.

(Giulio Prisco, in this scenario, is a lizard-alien from
another dimension who's trying to mess up the benevolent
superintelligences' altruistic plans. Eliezer Yudkowsky
has been hypnotized and led astray by the lizard bad
guys, and it's your job to set his feet back on the true
path. Or the Way, as he calls it. Damien Broderick was
supposed to be your partner in this cosmic mission, but
he chickened out.)

jimf said...

> Does anybody know of any texts online or otherwise in which
> this thesis is seriously proposed that are actually available
> for examination?

Yeah, it's a kind of a Laura Knight-Jadczyk meets Doris Lessing
thing.

"Did you ever feel like Neo, out of the Matrix? That something
is just fundamentally wrong, like an itch that you cannot scratch?
Well that is the premise for this series of books. What if the
world we live in has more to it than what is immediately visible?"
http://www.amazon.com/Wave-Riding-Bk-1/dp/1897244266

"Even as it gives an epic account of the struggles between Canopus
and its rivals over the fate of the universe, Canopus in Argos
comments, with Lessing's characteristic insight and eloquence,
on human history and our prospects for the future."
http://www.amazon.com/Canopus-Argos-Archives-Doris-Lessing/dp/0679741844

Anonymous said...

That's crazy. The truth is that we all know Carrico is a capitulationist tool of the Obama Deception...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw

FrF said...

On occasions, when Dale does his usual list of what he thinks are transhuamanist follies ("shiny robot bodies", "afraid to poop", "nano santa", etc.), I've been tempted to simply reply: "Actually, the way you put it, these things sound quite alluring".

:-)

Dale Carrico said...

Nobody is denying that wish-fulfillment fantasies are often couched in terms that have a certain appeal. It's actually somewhat built-in to the notion, yes?

Of course, as is often true of sanctimonious depictions of Heaven as well, sometimes these fantasies seem pretty dull and appalling -- choirs of angels without genitals singing hymns for all eternity and so on. And so too these wish-fulfillment fantasies often seem to those who don't share the particular kinks getting indulged in the particular wish-fulfillment fantasies often seem, er, curious -- the apparent horror in some quarters of the Robot Cult of poop and things bodily more generally and of the role of chance in human affairs and so on strikes me as rather bizarre, for example.

Anne Corwin said...

Wow, I think I laughed (quietly) out loud for about five minutes straight after reading this. Seriously, where do people come up with this stuff?

Giulio Prisco said...

Re "- choirs of angels without genitals singing hymns for all eternity and so on"

Let's not be so provincial. The visions of Heaven of many religions are more like "- hordes of sexaholics with genitals screwing like rabbits for all eternity and so on".

In our superlative robotic Heaven, those who prefer singing hymns will sing hymns, and those who prefer screwing will screw. Or does this sound too libertropian?

Dale Carrico said...

Libertopian? No, it sounds like a dumb futurological fundamentalist, possibly somewhat repressed sexually, who didn't grasp that everybody else was joking about how silly daydreams of heaven tend to be at the level of detail, and who treated this comment thread as an occasion instead to start indulging in literal sexual wish-fulfillment fantasizing in front of our eyes because that's just how far gone he actually is.

Giulio Prisco said...

Re "who didn't grasp that everybody else was joking"

Try "who was also joking"?

Dale Carrico said...

Oh. Okay.

Good one.

FrF said...

Two days ago I was talking to a friend and mentioned that I envied people who have no active sexual interests. (I dimly remember an article at "Salon" about this topic but can't find it right now.)

My friend was skeptical whether sexual disinterest to such a degree could actually be possible, I referred to the above mentioned anecdotal evidence from "Salon". Then I said that if I ever met such a lucky person I'd congratulate him or her and I was at least to some degree serious!

jimf said...

> Two days ago I was talking to a friend and mentioned that I
> envied people who have no active sexual interests. (I dimly remember
> an article at "Salon" about this topic but can't find it right now.)

Well, I found two Salon articles (both about women), either of which
might be the one you remember:

"The 30-year-old virgins"
It was once a badge of honor. But to the surprising number of adult
women today who have not had sex, virginity is nothing but a curse.
By Yael Kohen
Sept. 6, 2006
http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/09/06/virgins/

and

"Sexless and loving it"
Dawn Eden, author of a new memoir about chastity, gets frank about
why she thinks forsaking sex has made her a better Christian, a better
lover and a better friend.
By Rebecca Traister
Dec. 22, 2006
http://archive.salon.com/mwt/feature/2006/12/22/dawn_eden/index.html

However, if you're referring to the phenomenon known as "involuntary
celibacy" (such people also call themselves "incel")

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Involuntary_celibacy
http://www.involuntarycelibacy.com/

then you should know that: 1) an absence of sexual **relationships** does
not necessarily imply an absence of sexual interest and
2) many such people would hardly consider themselves enviable.

Incel Video Draft Two (part 1)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ryuut3MYI0

Incel Video Draft Two (part 2)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8s7XMT2lo_E

Brian G. Gilmartin, _Shyness & Love_
http://www.love-shy.com/Gilmartin/toc.html

jimf said...

> I dimly remember an article at "Salon" about this topic. . .

Hm. This actually seems to have come up rather often at Salon.

"15 years without knocking boots"
I didn't intend to go without sex for a decade and a half.
But celibacy isn't something you necessarily plan.
By Kit Naylor
Dec. 9, 2008
http://www.salon.com/mwt/feature/2008/12/09/kit_naylor/

**This** one (finally) is about guys:

"Not this year, dear"
I have very little interest in sex -- and neither do millions
of other Americans. So where are our support groups?
By Sandy Morris
Nov. 23, 1999
http://www.salon.com/health/sex/urge/1999/11/23/sexdrive/

FrF said...

Thanks for the links, Jim! Of course I wasn't referring to incels, that would have been inappropriate and almost cruel. But they are a good example for how much pain and confusion sexuality can cause.

With a little Google luck I finally found the Salon piece:

http://dir.salon.com/story/mwt/feature/2005/05/26/asexual/print.html

"Asexual and proud!

A growing number of so-called asexuals insist that their indifference toward sex isn't a pathology, but an "orientation" like being gay. But some experts say that instead of comforting themselves with a label, "amoebas" should seek help."

FrF said...

A user at Less Wrong claims that he had radical surgical intervention on his intimate parts to become, among other things, "more rational". This is fascinatingly fearless - and scary (at least for me).